Hon Deputy Speaker, let me unequivocally convey my heartfelt apologies to those learners in Limpopo for the late delivery of textbooks. We neither wish to defend nor condone it. Let me also take heart from and empathise with those learners who wrote those very polite and eloquent letters to the President. At least we can take comfort from the fact that they are indeed literate and have a good command of the language. Having said that, perhaps I should try to explain to you that the challenges of education are enormous. We should recognise that in Limpopo, every Grade 1, 2 and 3 child to whom textbooks were to be delivered, but were not, had indeed received a workbook on literacy, numeracy, life skills and first additional language by the beginning of the year. In other words, ... [Interjections.] Well, it is an apology, but at the same time ... [Interjections.] Please, you wanted an explanation ... [Interjections.]
Order! Hon members, allow other people to hear the Deputy Minister's explanation.
The same applies to the Grade 2, 3 and 10 learners who were going to receive textbooks but had only received free textbooks in mathematics and science - Quintiles 1 to 5.
I wish to say that we have learnt hard lessons from the experience in Limpopo. Indeed, the appropriate and necessary steps are being taken to ensure that we never again repeat this failure or let this failure to deliver textbooks on time recur. We have listened to you as you raised your concerns and you should surely have the dignity to allow us to respond and explain.
Given the important challenges of literacy and numeracy in this country, one must at least recognise that today 56 million workbooks are being delivered to Grade 1 to 9 learners across the country, including the Western Cape, where the books are being delivered to schools. Today, as we look at the challenges of the infrastructure that we have to establish at schools, we notice that 27 schools are being closed in the Western Cape, while 49 are being built in the Eastern Cape. This is part of the effort to address the enormous challenges that we face in the system of education.
Today we have to recognise that every child among the 8,75 million children who go to school receives a meal every day. We have to recognise that in the context of the poverty and huge economic challenges that we face, more than 8 million children in our schools go to no-fee schools, where they are not expected to pay any fees. We have to recognise that more than 400 000 learners are being transported to school daily. We have to recognise that more than 1 000 schools are in partnership with the SA Police Service to ensure that we create an environment that is conducive to learning - that does not detract from the enormous challenges that we have in literacy and numeracy.
Basically, never before has any government been able to deliver books at the rate that we are, in order to enhance literacy and numeracy. Never before has this government, or any other, been able to test more than 6 million children on literacy and numeracy. Next month, every child between Grade 1 and 6 is, again, going to be tested on literacy and numeracy so that we can determine precisely whether they have made progress or not and what kind of interventions need to be made. I raise this in the context of the fact that yes, indeed, what occurred in Limpopo was not right and it cannot be condoned or defended.
Certainly, we are going to learn lessons from this experience and ensure that it does not repeat itself. However, we cannot be blind to other realities; where efforts are being made to ensure that quality education is being provided. We have always argued that the right to basic education is an unqualified right. We should certainly take every step to ensure that this is indeed provided to our children.
With regard to the UDM, it's quite interesting that we have received ... [Interjections.]
Madam Deputy Speaker, on a point of order: There is a time limit in our Rules for a Minister's reply, and I humbly suggest that he has already exceeded his time.
The truth hurts. It's so hard to listen to the truth. With regard to the issue of corruption ... [Interjections.]
Minister, that is correct - unless you are answering for all the Ministers? [Interjections.] Hon members, I am addressing a point of order. I don't know why you are doing that.
Hon Deputy Speaker, the reason why I spoke for so long is that there were six issues, raised by six different speakers. As a member of the executive, I have a responsibility to respond. [Interjections.]
No. Can I make an appeal? The members who raised those issues didn't want to hear the answers. So, don't respond. Your time is up. [Applause.]
Madam Deputy Speaker, on a point of order, and a serious one: The remark you have just made is totally out of order. What you have just said is that members make statements, but they don't want to hear the responses. I want you to withdraw that, please. I really want to ask you, seriously, to reconsider it.
Do you know why I was saying that? While the Deputy Minister was speaking, everybody was making a noise! Everybody was making a noise while he was responding!
Madam Deputy Speaker, you are supposed to be impartial, and your remark clearly ... [Interjections.]
I think I am.
No, you are not! You are not! [Interjections.]
I would say that it goes for this side too. [Interjections.]
Madam Speaker, you have recognised me - may the Chief Whip please show some manners? [Interjections.]
Hon Deputy Speaker, we demand that Mr Watson withdraws what he said about the Deputy Speaker ... [Interjections.]
I will not withdraw. [Interjections.]
... because it is totally out of order. [Interjections.]
I demand that you sit down and listen! [Interjections.]
This House is not a place where you debate with the Speaker. It is a House where you make an input and subject yourself to the rulings of the Speaker.
Madam Deputy Speaker, are you recognising me?
Thank you, hon Chief Whip. Mr Watson, do you have something more to say?
I was busy addressing you, Madam Deputy Speaker, when the Chief Whip of the ANC jumped up. I think he has forgotten what protocol in Parliament means. [Interjections.]
I didn't jump up. I stood up.
I asked you to reconsider your remarks, Deputy Speaker.
Hon Deputy Speaker, on a point of order: It's correct in terms of the Rules that the hon Minister should stick to his time, if there are other Ministers who would like to answer. I want to propose that, in terms of the Rules, you should give the Minister sufficient time to answer because this is a very important issue. The fact of the matter is that numerous statements were made on this specific issue, education, and we needed a healthy answer. But, I am afraid, Madam Deputy Speaker, with all due respect, if you, as a Chairperson in the House, the Deputy Speaker, rule or say from the Chair that the Minister does not have to answer because members do not want to hear the answer, that is completely unacceptable. It is not for the Deputy Speaker to make such a statement. [Interjections.]
Hon Deputy Speaker, with due respect to Mr Mulder, the conduct of some members of the opposition was such that the Deputy Speaker had no option but to ... [Interjections.]
Madam Deputy Speaker, the Chief Whip does not have carte blanche.
Hon Deputy Speaker, I am still addressing you. If that was the case, then ... [Interjections.]
No, no, no, I recognised only one person, who is still on the floor.
Thank you.
Some members complain when others jump up and speak before they are recognised.
Deputy Speaker, I waited for my turn.
Can you observe that protocol?
Yes, I will do so.
Continue, hon member.
I will conclude, hon Deputy Speaker. I think it's not in order for you to decide on behalf of members who have just made statements that it is not for the Minister to answer because they didn't want to hear the answers. That is not correct. If the members misbehaved while the Minister was speaking, you should have called them to order. The fact of the matter is that it's not for you, with all due respect, to make such a ruling. I think you were out of order.
Thank you, hon member. What you didn't hear was when a point of order was called about the time. I said I was under the impression that the Minister was answering many questions and immediately, from this side, there was a "no, no, no, he is supposed to stick to the question". I was making a ruling on a point of order about the time, and while I said that he was answering more than one question, those comments still continued. That is why I made a ruling that he shouldn't respond because I was sure they didn't want responses. Based on that question, and given the noise while he was speaking, I genuinely thought the members didn't necessarily need the responses. Can we move on from this item? Are there other Ministers who want to respond?
Madam Deputy Speaker, on a point of order: I requested you to withdraw your statement ... [Interjections.]
No, no, I am not going to withdraw it. I made a ruling that the speaker mustn't continue. [Interjections.]
No, I asked you to withdraw the ruling that we didn't want to hear ... [Interjections.]
No, I am not going to do that. [Interjections.]
We didn't ask for the information. [Interjections.]
No, sit down, Mr Watson, please. Hon Watson, sit down. [Interjections.]
Are you refusing to withdraw it? [interjections.]
Hon Watson, sit down.
Madam Deputy Speaker, with your permission, I would like to give my time to the hon Surty so that he can continue answering. [Applause.]
Hon Surty, you have the hon Gigaba's time.
No, Madam Deputy Speaker, on a point of order: May I please address you on that issue?
On what issue now?
On the fact that you are now putting the question to hon Surty on whether he wants to take hon Gigaba's time. There is no allocation to an individual Minister. The Rules are very clear: up to five Ministers may respond, but answers are directly related to the members' statements made. None of the Ministers has the right to hand over his or her time to another Minister. The Rules do not make provision for that. On top of that, I want the Chief Whip to also take note of Rule 47.
Thank you very much, I have noted that.
My apologies to the hon Chief Whip of Cope, I thought she had finished. Deputy Speaker, I would like to ask that you examine whether the Chief Whip of the DA should withdraw the statement he made. I was not aware that the Chief Whip of the Opposition was actually a presiding officer and that he could rule anyone out of order. I believe this should be examined and he should be made to withdraw it. [Applause.]