Hon Chairperson, hon members and hon Sibande, let me start by quoting from the United Nations Declaration on Principles of International Law of 24 October 1970, which states as follows:
All States enjoy sovereign equality. They have equal rights and duties and are equal members of the international community, notwithstanding differences of an economic, social, political and other nature.
In particular, sovereign equality includes the following elements:
a) States are judicially equal;
b) Each State enjoys the rights inherent in full sovereignty;
c) Each State has the duty to respect the personality of the other States;
d) The territorial integrity and political independence of the State are inviolable;
e) Each State has the right freely to choose and develop its political, social, economic and cultural systems;
f) Each State has the duty to comply fully and in good faith with its international obligations and to live in peace with other States.
It is important that all of us are familiar with these principles, which are the basis of South Africa's Constitution and foreign policy.
Furthermore, Swaziland was a member of the African Union, formerly known as the Organisation of African Unity, and SADC long before we established a free and democratic South Africa in 1994. At the same time, Swaziland is a founding member of the Southern African Customs Union, the oldest existing customs union in the world, established in 1910.
Let me also recall that SADC's vision is one of a common future within a regional community where the economic wellbeing, improvement of the standards of living and quality of life, freedom and social justice, and peace and security for the peoples of Southern Africa will be ensured. This shared vision is anchored in the common values and principles and the historical and cultural affinities that exist among the peoples of Southern Africa.
Our bilateral and other relations with Swaziland are basically informed by these factors. Swaziland was facing a severe cash crisis. Therefore the main reason for this loan was to help her through this budget predicament. Our financial and technical assistance to the Kingdom of Swaziland is aimed at preventing what is at the moment essentially a cash flow crisis from becoming a financial and economic crisis. South Africa's loan will be offered in three instalments, which will be transferred to the Central Bank of Swaziland. The first instalment will be given immediately after the signing of agreements. The subsequent equal payments will follow in October and in February next year.
Under the terms of the loan, Swaziland must protect the peg between the lilangeni, that kingdom's currency, and the South African rand. She must also strengthen financial reporting and the auditing of her accounts. In other words, Swaziland must implement both governance and fiscal reforms. Most importantly, she must increase dialogue with the Swazi people.
The terms of the agreement include the fact that the government of Swaziland should meet the following objectives. It must promote economic and social development, democracy, human rights and good governance. Swaziland must also comply with the fiscal reforms recommended by the International Monetary Fund. These will be monitored by a task team from the World Bank, the International Monetary Fund, South Africa's National Treasury and the African Development Bank. It was also agreed that South Africa would work with Swaziland to build governance and fiscal capacity.
The promotion of the political and economic integration of the continent continues to drive the African agenda. As this is the case, a commitment exists to give impetus to this objective, which is rooted in the need to strengthen Africa's political, economic and social development, as well as her peace and security agenda.
The South African government has committed to a deepened contribution to regional and continental security, stability and sustainable development. Within this context, strengthening regional integration in the Southern African Customs Union and SADC remains a major priority that will contribute to the sustained integration of the region into the global economy. South Africa places particular emphasis on political cohesion, economic integration and the building of efficient and responsive economic infrastructure.
Sekela Mongameli, bengingacela lokhu okulandelayo ukuthi ubeke obala ukuthi ... [Deputy President, I would request that you give clarity on the following.]
Is this Bill intending to reduce the number of people who are running out of Swaziland and into South Africa due to political instability, poverty and economic crisis, ...
... ngoba Sekela Mongameli lichazile ukuthi isimo se-SADC sithini ... [... because the Deputy President did explain the position of SADC ...]
... with regard to stability. Contrary to what the Deputy President has said, there is no political stability in Swaziland. People are running away.
Hon member, I think that was actually a comment and not a question. Is there any other follow-up question? Oh, does the Deputy President want to comment on that? It was more of a comment than a question.
Hon Chairperson, I agree that it was a comment. Indeed, people migrate for a variety of reasons, one of which may be the economic situation in a country. That is why we have many foreign nationals who are economic refugees and are migrating in search of better opportunities elsewhere.
With Swaziland being our neighbour close by, if the situation should indeed become dire, we may see an increased influx of Swazi nationals coming over our borders. However, this is really a loan from the SA Reserve Bank to the Central Bank of Swaziland. It is a loan entered into under the conditions that I have outlined.
Chairperson, the Deputy President has outlined the assistance and the intention to create a peaceful atmosphere and also to support the development of Swaziland. I would like to find out from him if this ipso facto becomes policy within the Southern African region, with respect to all our neighbouring states - Mozambique, Botswana, Lesotho and so on?
Chairperson, I think each case will be treated on its own merits should other members of SADC - God forbid that other SADC states should experience similar difficulties - want the advancement of such a loan. Remember, those countries that are members of the Southern African Customs Union actually get allocations from the Customs Union. This is even the case with this loan. If Swaziland defaulted, it would be recovered from the allocation from Sacu.
As I said, we hope that the SADC region will stabilise and experience economic development to prevent us from facing the kinds of problems that Germany is facing in Europe today. Germany is surrounded by countries that are unable to meet their debt obligations. We hope that we do not experience a similar problem here in this region.
Deputy President, you have just indicated that should Swaziland default on repayments, our Reserve Bank would recover the money from the Customs Union's payments. Is it not true that the reason the Kingdom of Swaziland is in such a bad financial situation is the low revenue from the Customs Union? Therefore, if we were to stop that revenue to recover the loan, would that not then simply bankrupt Swaziland - which is exactly the motivation for giving them this loan now?
Secondly, it seems that despite the lack of any democracy in the Kingdom of Swaziland, the state of emergency and the locking-up of numerous political prisoners, no conditions have been placed on this loan to ensure that political prisoners are released and the state of emergency is lifted. Is that true?
We allow only one follow-up question and you are now asking a lot. We will conclude with that one.
Yes, indeed, it is true that if those who are in debt have to go out to secure loans to service their debt or other obligations, they actually sink deeper into debt. It is a vicious circle. That is why I said, "were they to default". We are hoping that with these measures - these conditions imposed on them with regard to governance, as well as fiscal efficiency - they will avoid sinking deeper into the red and that we will not find it necessary to make good this debt by appropriating their allocation from the Southern African Customs Union, Sacu.
That is the situation that faces the United States of America. You will know that President Obama had a pitched battle to get approval to increase their debt levels so that he could borrow more money to service their debt and keep their heads above water. So, it is a vicious circle. It happens to individuals as much as it happens to countries.
It is not true that the loan was given without conditionalities. The conditionalities that have been outlined are in place and the first tranche of this loan will be released once all agreements are signed - the MOU and the agreement between the central banks. One is that government should engage in dialogue with its own people to ensure that there is engagement and democracy. The issue of prisoners and so on would be resolved in the course of that dialogue with the Swazi people. We hope that the system will allow for greater democratic participation by civil society and we hope that democratic institutions, including the Parliament, will be restored.
Deputy President, my question is about the task team that will make sure that Swaziland is adhering to fiscal efficiency, and the accountability of that task team. You have mentioned a number of stakeholders coming from various institutions. To whom will they be accountable?
The International Monetary Fund, IMF, and the World Bank are involved in monitoring the reforms that Swaziland is expected to implement. The reason is that Swaziland is in debt and can't apply for a loan from any other source without the approval of the World Bank and the IMF because it already owes them quite a handsome amount. That is why they are involved in this one. They had to be involved to ensure that the measures that have been recommended are adhered to.
South Africa also has an interest in ensuring that the measures are implemented and that there is better fiscal management. As you know, Swaziland is a monarchy and I suppose a royal house is ordinarily not exactly accountable to its subjects. This situation creates a window even for His Majesty to subject himself to the fiscal management of the national kitty. Historically, in the past, some monarchs always introduced themselves as the state itself. They are the personification of the state.
Establishment of programmes by Moral Regeneration Movement in line with Charter of Positive Values
8. Ms N D Ntwanambi (ANC) asked the Deputy President:
(1) Whether the government and/or any structure of government, including the Moral Regeneration Movement, MRM, has established any programmes in line with the Charter of Positive Values to mobilise communities to shun any attempt by any individual or criminal elements to perpetuate brutal, violent attacks and killing of defenceless persons such as women, children and foreign nationals in our communities; if not, why not; if so, (a) what is the nature of such programmes and (b) what messages are conveyed to communities in this regard;
2) whether the government will consider such programmes, especially during the important dates and periods such as Women's Month, Women's Day, Child Protection Week, World Refugee Day, Africa Day and other dates and periods; if not, why not; if so, what are the relevant details?