Points of order were raised by the hon Mathys and the hon Mtileni during the plenary of the said date, 14 May 2015. Both members raised a point of order on whether it was parliamentary for the President to say that he will deal with the hon Mtileni outside. The hon Mtileni alleged that he felt threatened by the remark.
Hon members, I indicated on that day that I would consult the Hansard and make the ruling on the matter. I have done so. According to the Hansard, the President said, "Perhaps I can see him outside and deal with the issues". [Interjections.] Order, members! The President said this when he was responding to a question dealing with Nkandla, which was, at any rate, not on the Question Paper of the day.
In my view, the President referred to the issues within the context of what he was responding to - and according to the Hansard, the President clearly did not refer to dealing with him, the hon Mtileni, but to the issues, outside. Having had regard to the ordinary meaning of these words, as well as the context within which they were used, it cannot be said that the remark amounted to a threat, nor can it be said to be unparliamentary.
I accordingly rule that the remark made by the President is not unparliamentary, and the points of order raised by the two members can therefore not be upheld. [Applause.]
I wish to make another ruling. The hon Dlamini rose on a point of order on the same day. The point of order was whether it was parliamentary to call hon members "voting cows". I undertook to consult the list of unparliamentary expressions and to revert to the House.
Hon members, the context in which these particular words or phrases were used affects their meaning. The fact that an offensive word or phrase has been used hypothetically or figuratively, or put in the form of a question, does not render it unparliamentary. It is common cause that, at times, members express their views forcefully and do engage in a robust debate. It is, however, not acceptable when the tone or the nature of the words to the remark become so ill-tempered that it negatively reflects on the humanity of the members of the House.
The remarks by the hon Mtileni clearly referred to the members of this House. The remark likened the hon members of this House to animals. I rule, therefore, that the remark made by the hon Mtileni was unparliamentary, and therefore order the hon Mtileni to withdraw the remark. Hon Mtileni, will you withdraw the remark?
Chairperson, could you please remind me of the remark? I can't remember it. [Interjections.]
Hon Mtileni, you referred to the members of this House as "voting cows". I have just ruled on the remark, which the hon Dlamini rose on to say was unparliamentary.
So, do you say you checked with the Hansard?
Can I hear you?
Are you saying you checked with the Hansard and ...
I have just read ... Hon Mtileni, please. [Interjections.] Hon Mtileni ... Order! Order, members! It is good to ... [Interjections.] ... make light of the matters of the House, sometimes, when we are very tired and sometimes, just to lighten the atmosphere. In this particular instance, the hon member has heard me making a ruling from start to finish on the remarks he made about members of this House being voting cows. Hon Mtileni, will you stand up and withdraw the remarks?
Chairperson, for the sake of time, I withdraw. [Laughter.]
Thank you very much.