Deputy Chairperson, hon delegates, representatives of nongovernmental organisations, NGOs, civil society in the gallery, and fellow South Africans, I want to thank you for coming today to listen to Budget Vote 2: Parliament being debated.
We have come ... not as pretenders to greatness but as a particle of a people whom we know to be noble and heroic, enduring, multiplying, permanent, rejoicing in the expectation and knowledge that their humanity will be reaffirmed and enlarged by open and unfettered communion with the nations of the world.
These were the words of Nelson Mandela in his address to the Joint Session of the United States Congress, a few months after his release from jail. Twenty years later, our country is on the eve of hosting the biggest soccer spectacle in the world - the Fifa Soccer World Cup. Indeed, our humanity is being reaffirmed by the nations of the world.
As you know, ladies and gentlemen, the theme of Parliament this year is: Celebrate the legacy of Mandela - Contribute to nation-building. Mandela's legacy is legendary. It is about the embodiment of our struggle for freedom. It is about constitutionalism. It is about nation-building. It is about great love for humanity.
Towards advancing the project of reaffirming our humanity, resources have been made available to support the work of Parliament. In the previous financial year, 2009-10, Parliament was initially allocated a budget of R1,35 billion. Three hundred and seventy-seven million of this was a direct charge against national revenue for members' remuneration. Nine hundred and seventy-four million was appropriated through a Budget Vote to fund the five main programmes of Parliament.
In addition to the R1,35 billion, an additional allocation of R133,9 million was received for unavoidable costs. This resulted in a total allocation of about R1,5 billion. The unavoidable costs were, for example, as a result of expenses for information and communication technology, ICT, equipment for the fourth Parliament, which cost us R14,1 million; participation in various international forums, which cost us R31,1 million; and adjustments to members benefits, which cost us R13,2 million.
In this regard, funded programmes, which are provided for in the new budget, are the following. The first programme is Administration. The programme is intended to provide strategic leadership, institutional policy, administration and corporate services to support Members of Parliament. The initial allocation for the previous year was R247 million, and the new allocation is R317 million.
The second programme is Legislation and Oversight. This programme is intended to enable Parliament to pass legislation and oversee executive action. The initial allocation for the previous year was R187 million. The new allocation is R282 million.
The third programme is Public and International Participation. This programme allows Parliament to carry out public participation projects and participate in international relations activities. The initial allocation for the previous year was R67 million. The new allocation is R87 million.
The fourth programme is Members' Facilities. This programme is intended to provide travel, information and communication services and other facilities for the Members of Parliament in both Houses of Parliament. The initial allocation for the previous year was R212 million. The new allocation is R211 million.
The fifth programme is Associated Services. This programme is intended to provide financial support to political parties represented in Parliament. It is divided into political party support, constituency support and party leadership support. Can the party secretariat and media take note of this? It's very important. The initial allocation for the previous year was R258 million. The new allocation is R282 million.
When reflecting on the actual expenditure budget of the 2009-10 financial year, Parliament spent 94% of its total budget allocation. One of the contributing factors to the underspending emanates from the mismatch between the swearing-in of the members of the Fourth Parliament and the beginning of the 2009-10 financial year. As we all know, the 2009-10 financial year began on 1 April 2009, whereas members of the Fourth Parliament were only sworn in on 6 May 2009. Effectively, the Fourth Parliament began to operate in June 2009 after the induction of new members. What is important is what we want to do with the new budget I have just outlined.
Let us first look at the strategic framework. Both the National Assembly and the National Council of Provinces, NCOP, contributed to the development of the strategic framework for Parliament which was approved by the Parliamentary Oversight Authority in March this year. The framework, which contains our policy imperatives, proposes the following strategic objectives for this term. The first one is strengthening the oversight function and establishing a strong culture of overseeing executive action. In this regard, we would like to improve Parliament's capacity to exercise its constitutional oversight role by developing protocols for assessing the performance of all organs of state and providing them with sufficient resources to effectively carry out their role. In order to ensure outcomes- based oversight, Parliament needs to ensure dedicated support for committees, development of members' capacity, and improved institutional management.
Oversight that focuses on outcomes will assist in the process of reaffirming our humanity as the citizens of a democratic country. The implementation of the oversight and accountability model is key to improving our approach to add co-ordination of oversight work. Towards this, an implementation team comprising officials and jointly chaired by House Chairpersons of the two Houses responsible for oversight was established.
The recommendations of the model were reviewed and systematically divided into the following work areas: parliamentary planning, institutional mechanisms, human resource capacity, facilities, technology and systems, new mechanisms, public participation, and the Money Bills Amendment Procedure and Related Matters Bill, which is now, of course, an Act. We are in the process of considering these recommendations for implementation.
As this House, we have agreed on the priorities for oversight during the period of the Fourth Parliament. They are agriculture, economic development, health and social development, human settlements, police, rural development, and land reform. We need to pay attention to these areas at committee and institutional levels in our effort to contribute to the work of Parliament.
The second strategic plan that we are looking atis increasing public involvement and participation in building a responsive people's Parliament. Our democracy is both representative and participatory. The Constitution provides for public involvement in the processes of Parliament. With regard to the NCOP's contribution in this regard, I am happy to report that the implementation of the new approach to the Taking Parliament to the People programme is delivering the impact we have always wanted it to deliver. For example, in the case of Limpopo, some of the mining houses are already implementing the commitments they made towards social investment.
To further strengthen public participation, we are developing a public participation model for Parliament. The Joint Rules Committee has agreed that the Third Parliament's Joint Task Team on the Legislative Process in Parliament be revived to link its work with the issues relating to public participation. The task team is expected to report to the Joint Rules Committee within six months after re-establishment.
The third point is strengthening co-operative government and fostering improved co-operation and relations. Many of the aspects of the Constitution relating to Parliament's role in promoting co-operative government and intergovernmental relations require the development of processes and practice. Many areas have seen advancements, including the greater role of this House in interventions and in the area of intergovernmental fiscal relations.
However, we need to do more. We need to review the functioning of present arrangements as embodied in legislation. We appreciate the work done by this House in processing interventions. I think the committee is doing a great job in that line in terms of the number of interventions that we see coming to the NCOP. Our role is to ensure that these interventions are not arbitrary. With the increase in the number of notices with regard to interventions in municipalities, we appreciate that a lot of work still needs to be done to improve governance in the local government sphere.
We are in the process of reconfiguring the portfolios of our two House Chairpersons in the NCOP so as to provide for a new portfolio on intergovernmental relations and co-operative government. The intention is to improve our performance in this area.
On the issue of nation-building, Parliament aims to embark on a project to increase its contribution to nation-building through enhancing unity and democracy in South Africa. The envisaged "Project Democracy" is to be used as a platform for robust and active involvement of Members of Parliament, as well as extensive public engagement. We will elaborate on this bold initiative after we have properly conceptualised it.
Strategic plan number four is to improve and widen the role of Parliament in international co-operation and participation. In the period under review, we participated in various regional, continental and international forums to promote the African agenda and the role South Africa plays in this regard. It is important to note that Parliament finds itself in a fast- changing global domain.
Going forward, we need to pay particular attention to the increasing role of Parliament in international relations. But the immediate task is to transform the nature of support given to MPs from being mainly logistics to being content-oriented, especially when it comes to international participation. In order to elevate Parliament's role in international relations, we must start by improving our support capacity in research and policy areas because those are the areas that I think are lacking in supporting the members. If we don't provide the members with good research and assist them in terms of the policy that we are applying as our policy for international co-operation, then we are denying them the right of having the knowledge that they have to use when they interact with other political multilateral bodies. This is especially so in the context of the 2011 deadline to transform the Pan-African Parliament into a legislative body.
The last strategic plan is building an effective and efficient institution. In order to achieve all the above, it is important that we pay particular attention to the task of building an effective and efficient Parliament. Towards this, we need to continue to improve our human resource capacity, including a reorientation towards entrenching a culture of service delivery. As we roll out the new system and more modern technology, it is important for us to realise that a modern Parliament like ours will function better if we all improve our ICT skills. I know we still have a great shortage of those.
Can we all use our computers? [Interjections.] Surely? Am I the only one who can't? [Interjections.] Oh, all right. I will check that very soon because I'll be visiting your offices checking how many of us can communicate with their constituencies whilst in Cape Town doing their job. I will also be checking how many of you can communicate with the continent and the international world whilst you are here in Parliament doing your job. I will check that. I will visit anyone unannounced and ask him or her to teach me how it is done.
We are reviewing the support structure in the NCOP to respond to the need to follow up and assess our work. In line with the recommendations of the study we have conducted on Taking Parliament to the People, I have appointed a special adviser on intergovernmental matters in my office. Building an effective and efficient Parliament will require that we provide adequate space for members to do their work. Work is being done in this regard as part of the space utilisation project and more information will be made available. The strategic plan for the Fourth Parliament, to be brought before this House as soon as possible, will give more detail with regard to these strategic objectives. Unfortunately, the document has been delayed because of political party processes.
In conclusion, in 1995, before the Rugby World Cup Nelson Mandela, who spoke of us as a particle of the people and the servants of the newly enfranchised, gave the captain of the Springboks a poem entitled Invictus with the following words:
I am the master of my fate: I am the captain of my soul.
The project of reaffirming our humanity is in our hands. Collectively, we are its masters and captains; nobody else but all of us as we are sitting here.
At this point, let me congratulate our parliamentary rugby team for their success during a visit to the United Kingdom and Ireland in November last year. They brought the trophy back to Parliament. I am doing this because I have realised that hon members today have shown their support to different sports clubs. I heard that Mr Lees supports AmaZulu. I also heard that Mr Watson supports the Bulls, and so on. So, we all have our favourites.
On behalf of the millions of South Africans whom you have the privilege to represent, I commend Budget Vote No 2: Parliament, totalling R1,571 billion, inclusive of the direct charge. I do so in the hope that you will continue to support the project of reaffirming our people. I do so in the hope that you will support the work of this Parliament in giving a voice to the voiceless and holding the government to account. I thank you and the officials for making it possible to elaborate on an important project for our nation.
I want to thank the Secretary to Parliament and the staff. I also want to thank our staff in the NCOP, the Secretary to the NCOP, and other staff members. I want to thank you also, hon members, for the active role that you are playing in your work, exactly one year after having started in this House. It is now time for implementation, not time to play. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Deputy Chairperson, Chairperson of the NCOP, hon fellow delegates, this will be the seventh opportunity for me to participate in a debate on the Budget Vote for Parliament. I must say that, especially in regard to the NCOP, much has been achieved over the years. In saying that, one cannot but acknowledge the tremendous role played by our Chairperson, hon M J Mahlangu, in building on the image of the institution whilst, at all times, considering the interests and the needs of the delegates.
During the past six years and seven Budget Vote debates, I have stood here drawing attention to many shortcomings in our operation, whilst offering suggestions to improve and acknowledging the positive. To me, possibly the worst nightmares emanated over the years from being steered and bulldozed by the administration and staff of the institution, rather than by the presidium and the members. Speaking on behalf of my party, the DA, I have always maintained that we are called Members of Parliament because Parliament is our institution and should, as such, be governed by us.
I am happy to acknowledge that that has now come to an end. Whilst planning and decision-making is now firmly in the hands of those elected to govern the NCOP, serious thought must be given to more getting input from the ordinary delegates to establish their views and needs, especially when it comes to major events and excursions like Taking Parliament to the People, workshops and conferences. Questions to the executive remain one of the most important tools in our oversight function. However, I am afraid it has steadily become a source of great frustration to the delegates. We are aware of the fact that the Chairperson is attending to the problem of written questions from the NCOP not being answered in good time, and we thank him for that. But this perceived disregard of the NCOP is also reflected in the attendance by Ministers at question sessions in the NCOP. Then I ask: Why is the National Assembly, NA, favoured by having questions posed to and answered by both the President and the Deputy President, whilst in the NCOP we only have the privilege of questions to the Deputy President? Is that not just another contributing factor to the attitude of some individuals of treating the NCOP as inferior?
The update of the Rules of the NCOP and their application in the House is also a matter that has been uppermost in our minds over many years. I am happy to report that we, as the subcommittee, have gone a long way in considering amendments. We look forward to the finalisation of the Rules by the Rules Committee at the meeting scheduled by the Chairperson to start on 4 June, so that we can have a fresh set of Rules to work with when we come back from the Fifa extravaganza.
Having up-to-date Rules is, however, by no means enough. We need to embark on a programme of empowering ourselves as delegates with regard to the how and when of those Rules, particularly to protect each other and ourselves. I am not propagating a stiff, militarised assembly where no one dares to be out of step at any time. On the contrary, legislatures all over the world have been known for spontaneous wit and humour, and that must be preserved at all costs.
However, when rising on serious points of order, points of clarity or requests to address the Chair, actions should be in accordance with the prescribed Rules. We must be serious and act accordingly. It also follows logically, and even more importantly, that decisions and rulings from the Chair should, likewise, be professional interpretations of the Rules and should add to the decorum of the House rather than break it down.
As in previous years, I have said nothing about the actual finances of Parliament because my party's Chief Whip and Deputy Chief Whip will again attend to that when addressing the National Assembly later today. I will, therefore, remain focused on the NCOP as such, and end with my favourite topic, namely the place and stature of the NCOP in society.
The sad fact is that we are still, and remain, an unknown entity in the world out there, a poor replacement for the once illustrious Senate of the Republic of South Africa. Now, much has been said about the problem and many recommendations have been made. Chairperson, you would recall that we even devoted part of our 10-year celebrations to discussing this matter. I will never forget the professor of constitutional affairs who stood up and said that he has taught 600 students, and if he doesn't know what the NCOP does, then how could we expect him to teach 600 students to know what we were doing.
But I have a solution. Let us make and implement one small change to the Constitution and rename this House the National Senate of Provinces. It won't be long before we will simply be referred to as the Senate and we, the delegates, will be senators once again. Think about it. I thank you.
Chairperson, because I only have about four minutes, I will try to be fast. Parliament is the grand institution of the nation. Our Parliament should be perceived as such by the people of the country. Perception in politics is everything. Ivor Chipkin says that our politics appeal to the wrong essentialism. They appeal to the essentialism of race and culture, instead of to the essentials of the Constitution.
As the principle of responsible government prevails in South Africa, the executive has to be fully accountable to the parliamentarians. Unfortunately, those who have most cause to raise the most issues are afforded the least time. Conversely, those who have the least questions are given too much time. Such an apportionment of time, as occurs in Parliament, fits very poorly with the principle of responsible government and contributes to the worst problem in government. Is Parliament really holding the government accountable? To answer this question, the Chairperson should produce a balance sheet. The facts must speak for themselves. This refers to answering of question by Ministers.
To us in Cope, it seems as though the parliamentarian majority only serves to democratically trump Parliament's constitutional obligations. Therefore, where electorates give a political party maximum support, they get minimum results. This irony is not lost on the people. South Africans are more likely to trust our courts than Parliament because Parliament does not give clear judgments on issues and is perceived to be hedging on challenges.
I now come to the question of the media. The media coverage of politics is about political conduct because Parliament offers no real debate on policies or current issues. The debilitation of Parliament is as a result of what we have made our Parliament to be.
In conclusion, if the role of Parliament in the public's mind is minimised and it can no longer serve as the grand institution, the people, to whom Parliament belongs, will increasingly reject Parliament. It is in our interests and the interests of the nation to revitalise Parliament. I thank you. [Applause.]
Chairperson, delegates, our guests in the gallery, I rise to support the budget of Parliament as presented by the Chairperson of the National Council of Provinces. It is now a year since this House was established in May 2009. This gives us an opportunity to reflect on the road we have travelled since then.
I would like to start by emphasising that the process of contributing to the development of the budget before us does not start and end with this debate. Parliament has a governance structure for considering issues throughout the year.
Our governance model provides for a Parliamentary Oversight Authority, which is co-chaired by the Speaker of the National Assembly and the Chairperson of the National Council of Provinces. The Parliamentary Oversight Authority is responsible for formulating policy directives in respect of the various services and facilities of Parliament.
Its mandate is to ensure an effective and efficient Parliament by putting in place an appropriate system of governance by means of which Parliament is managed and controlled in support and furtherance of its strategies and policies. The Parliamentary Oversight Authority is accountable directly to the two Houses of Parliament.
Members of Parliament make inputs to Parliament's budget via two primary structures. These are the Quarterly Consultative Forum and the Parliamentary Budget Forum. The Quarterly Consultative Forum is a forum that facilitates the input of Members of Parliament on matters related to members' facilities. The Parliamentary Budget Forum is the forum that prepares the parliamentary budget and reports on it. The composition of these structures is explained in the governance model document.
House Chairperson, one of the important tasks of the Fourth Parliament is the implementation of the oversight and accountability model. The impact of the model on the parliamentary programme is significant. For example, a complete oversight process would require additional time for constituency work to ensure sharper focus on oversight matters, greater public participation in parliamentary activities and the consideration of reports of committees, as well as private members' business. The programme framework to be proposed to the Joint Rules Committee, the Joint Programming Committee and the Programming Committees of both Houses must take into account these requirements.
The model identified potential mechanisms that could further strengthen oversight and accountability. Therefore, the Rules had to be reviewed to provide for regulatory frameworks in respect of the following: the processing of reports from sectoral parliaments; oversight of international agreements; executive compliance; joint reporting by committees; and referral of matters arising from reports of international bodies. The model recommends, among other things, the establishment and/or development of sufficient human resource capacity to enable committees to conduct effective oversight. We are responding to this by increasing support capacity in areas such as research and content analysis.
Also under consideration is the joint parliamentary oversight and assurance committee. This committee is proposed for the purposes of governing the work and function of committees in Parliament.
On the other hand, the implementation of the new Money Bills Amendment Procedure and Related Matters Act, Act 9 of 2009, presents new challenges for Parliament. The Act provides Parliament with a procedure to amend money Bills, as well as norms and standards for amending money Bills before provincial legislatures and related matters.
While much progress has been made to facilitate the implementation of this Act, such as the establishment of the Finance and Appropriations committees in each House, a lot still needs to be done. This includes, for example, processing and adoption of the Division of Revenue Bill. The provisions of the Act were implemented to process the Division of Revenue Bill. However, the time allocated for this process is too limited to invoke the provisions of the Mandating Procedures of Provinces Act to allow the provinces adequate time to process the Bill and provide mandates to their delegates in this House. With regard to the establishment of the parliamentary budget office, it is under consideration. We need to find a common and shared view of how this office should operate. A number of issues have still to be ironed out regarding, among others, the accounting responsibilities of the director and the roles of other structures within Parliament.
On legislative work, our focus has been the review of the legislation that has been passed and rectifying areas of weakness through amendments. However, there is a need for Parliament to ascertain the impact of the laws we pass. Through its committees, this House can start by focusing on section 76 legislation.
Hon members, we are aware of the expressed need to capacitate our committees. As I have indicated, work is being done to ensure that committees have the necessary capacity to carry out their responsibilities. This must include the capacity to ensure value for money and proper spending.
As you are aware, our financial environment is now regulated by the Financial Management of Parliament Act. The Act, which came into operation in April last year in accordance with the transitional arrangements as set out in Schedule 4, will help to ensure transparency, accountability and sound management of the revenue, expenditure, assets and liabilities of Parliament. It reinforces the constitutional status of Parliament in that it ensures a consultative relationship between Parliament and the National Treasury.
It is worth noting that the role of Parliament and the provincial legislatures is located within the broader scope of the legislative sector in South Africa. Through the Speakers' Forum, we continue to oversee the management and co-ordination of the legislative sector programmes as determined by the South African Legislative Sector Policy and Strategic Framework. This is important because we have one government, which is unitary but with regional features.
House Chairperson, I started by making reference to the work we do through the provincial week because it is important that we maintain the link with provinces. At this point, I am reminded of what former Indian Prime Minister Indira Gandhi once said:
My grandfather once told me that there were two kinds of people: those who do the work and those who take the credit. He told me to try to be in the first group; there was much less competition there.
Let us be part of the first group of people who do the work. Twelve months after the establishment of this House, allow me to raise certain questions to establish whether we have done what we were supposed to do.
The questions are as follows: What have we done to advance the mandate of this House? What have we done to respond to the priorities we set ourselves in August last year, which are contained in the NCOP Strategic Framework Plan? What have we done to promote intergovernmental relations and co- operative government in the conduct of our business? How have we followed up on service delivery matters that were the subject of consideration by this House? I would like the chairpersons of the committees and the Whippery to consider and respond to these questions before recess. Their responses will give us an opportunity to do an analysis in order to develop our first report, which should be ready after the 2010 Fifa Soccer World Cup.
The legacy of Mandela requires that we work hard to uplift our people and to destroy the remains of the legacy of apartheid. With these words, I would like to thank the officials for the support they continue to give us under the leadership of the Secretary to Parliament. Their role is indispensable as Members of Parliament rely on technical support to be able to do their work. Thank you. [Applause.]
House Chair, and all protocol observed, allow me to congratulate the hon Deputy Chair on the questions she has just asked. We should all ask ourselves those questions. We should take this House very seriously. Today I am going to speak from my heart and forget about the speech that is in front of me. The first thing that you should really know is that this is a serious budget. Since we are claiming that this is the people's Parliament, as members, we should ask ourselves if we are serving the people who voted for us, doing justice to the provinces, and are delivering the service to them. I believe that the increment of this budget is not much. Our important role is to provide oversight so that people can know the meaning and understand the purpose of the NCOP.
Through the media, we should go out there and make South Africans understand what the NCOP stands for. Fighting amongst ourselves when our people out there are suffering is not going to help us. As the NCOP, we should be hands-on concerning our oversight role and service delivery in the provinces.
The ID does not believe that allowing Ministers to devise their own ministerial handbook will achieve anything in terms of cutting down on expenses. Instead, the ID believes that an ad hoc committee consisting of all parties from both Houses should revise that ministerial handbook in order to bring it in line with the slogan, "Working together we can do more for our people". If we are serious, we will use that slogan to implement that and to see to it that people on the ground are getting the service. I believe that this House can do anything. There is nothing that is impossible for this House.
I believe that the NCOP has the capacity. When I listened to the people who debated in this House today, they all had the capacity. They had everything inside them to see to it that the Rules in this House are implemented in each and every province, so that the people can understand what the NCOP does in this country. I thank you. [Applause.]
UMntwana M M M ZULU: Sihlalo, ungixolele ngoba eNgilandi ngeke ngiye ngiseAfrika. Sihlalo womhlangano namalungu ahloniphekile ale Ndlu, kanye nezivakashi zethu ezikhona. Nami ngithi angizojoyina bonke abaningi asebekhulumile ngendaba yePhalamende kulo nyaka.
Bese sifisela impumelelo bonke abakhona abalisebenzelayo kulonyaka noma ungakapheli. Sihlalo, ngithi kuleminyaka eyishumi nesithupha eyedlule sakwazi ukuthi sithole intando yeningi sibe nomthethosisekelo wethu okuyiwona laba abafundile abathi yi "Supreme law of our land".
Ngithi ke kufuneka sibone ukuthi sihlukanise phakathi kwesikuzuzile nesingakuzuzanga ngoba njengabantu kufuneka sikwazi ukubheka ukuthi yikuphi esikuzuzile futhi yikuphi esingakuzuzanga. Lapho kufuneka singamalungu ePhalamende noma amalungu eSishayamthetho Sikazwelonke, namalungu eNdlu Yomkhandlu Kazwelonke Wezifundazwe siyohlala phansi sibheke ukuthi yikuphi esingakuzuzanga. Singenzenjani ukuze sikuzuze ukuze kusizakale abantu bakithi.
Bakithi, uma sibheka kulokhu kubhekwa kweMinyango kahulumeni lokhu abafundile abathi yi "oversight" ngithi kuwumsebenzi obaluleke kakhulu Sihlalo wale Ndlu ukuthi lomsebenzi wenzeke ngoba isibopho sokuchaza ngokwenzekayo yinto edingekayo kunoma yimuphi omunye umuntu kuleli lizwe. Ngoba uma ungenaso isibopho sokuchaza ngokwenzekayo kusho ukuthi usebenza nje, uyadunguza nje, nokugxekwa kufuneka ukuba ugxeke ngokwakhayo ukuze bakwazi nabantu ukuthi izinto zihamba kanjani.
Ngithi alukho nolulodwa usuku lapho kufuneka siziqhenye singabantu abamnyama baseNingizimu Afrika, noma njengabantu baseNingizimu Afrika, abahluphekayo bonke ukuba sikwazi ukuthi siphucule izimpilo zabantu bakithi bonke bakwazi ukuphumelela.
Bakithi lokho okuzuziwe obabamkhulu, abakuzuzanga baze bahamba belwela leli lizwe kuwo wonke amagumbi e-Afrika ngoba yonke indoda emnyama kuleli lizwe iyazi ukuthi amadoda amnyama alwa kanjani, elwa kukubi kungemnandi. Ubabomkhulu akaguqanga ngamadolo ephezu kogogo nje, waye la eSt Helena, eNorthern Cape, kwesakho De Beer ehlezi khona iminyaka. Akaze aguqa. Ngithi kulokho ke Sihlalo ngicela ukuthi njengeqembu leNkatha siyasesekela iSabiwomali ukuba sisetshenziswe kahle sikwazi ukusiza izidingo zabantu abampisholo kulelizwe. Ngiyabonga. (Translation of isiZulu speech follows.)
[Prince M M M ZULU: Chairperson, you will pardon me because I will not speak English while I am in Africa. Chairperson of the Council, hon members of this House, as well as our guests who are present, I just want to join all those who have spoken before me about the performance of Parliament this year.
We also wish all those who work for Parliament success this year, although the year has not yet ended. In the past 16 years we managed to bring about democracy and have our Constitution which is referred to by academics as the supreme law of our land.
I want say that we must separate what we have achieved from what we have not because as people we must be able to recognise what we have achieved and what we have not. What is expected of us as Members of Parliament or as members of the National Assembly, and as members of the National Council of Provinces, is to sit down and check what we did not achieve. What can we do to achieve it in order to assist our people?
Hon members, if we look at our monitoring function with regard to the government departments, which our academics refer to as oversight, I want to say that it is very important, Chairperson of this House, that this job should be done thoroughly because it is the responsibility of every person in this country to account about what is happening. If you do not have the responsibility to explain what is happening it means that you are not doing your best, that you have no direction and that you must be criticised constructively so that our people are informed of what is going on. There should not be a single day when we are proud as black people of South Africa, or as South Africans who are destitute. We must be able to make the lives of all our people better in order for them to succeed in life.
Hon members, what has been achieved by our grandfathers? They did not achieve anything; they died fighting for this country in Africa because every black man in this country knows that men fight under difficult circumstances. My grandfather did not consummate his relationship because he was imprisoned here in St Helena, in the Western Cape, where you reside, Mr De Beer. He lived there for a number of years. He never surrendered. In that context, as the IFP, we support the budget and it should be utilised effectively so that it could cater for the needs of black people in this country. Thank you.]]
Chairperson, we have noted the importance of this particular debate, and maybe before I deal with some issues, there is something I find very interesting that we need to reflect on. It comes from the DA and Cope.
The DA, for a very long time, has very consistently defended the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa. All of us agree that it is a very important document that we need to pride ourselves on. The formation of Cope was based on the defence of the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa. They have also been very consistent in bringing this to the attention of the South African populace, raising false alarms about how the ANC under the leadership of our President, Jacob Zuma, is going to undermine and amend the Constitution.
But I find it quite interesting that in this very important debate today, the DA and Cope are proposing amendments to the Constitution - very selective amendments to the Constitution, for that matter. And we find it very interesting that the DA, in particular, is giving leadership in that regard, that where there are shortcomings, we need to look at the amendment of the Constitution to go forward. And maybe one of the key things that we need to look at is the property clause because it is through that that we will be able to fight poverty, we will be able to fight the inequality that exists within our society that is created by the very same problems that this Constitution addresses here. [Applause.]
Since 1955, at the gathering of our people in Kliptown, at the Congress of the People, we have been very clear. Here, the people of South Africa declared that South Africa belongs to all those who live in it. It was at that particular gathering that we brought up the concept of a people's assembly, of a people's Parliament again. And that concept at that gathering has guided the ANC, throughout the processes of the bannings and even after our liberation. We continued to say, ours will be to build a people's Parliament in which all those who live in South Africa shall be part and parcel of it and will participate actively in deciding the path that our country is supposed to take. [Applause.]
It is not loose. That concept is not loose. It has a particular history as well, because that history is informed by the ANC's adoption of a concept referred to as the national democratic revolution. It was explained as follows - that our main mission is the creation of a South Africa that is nonracist, nonsexist and democratic, which will allow all our people to participate actively in the processes of our advancement.
Therefore, as we speak today we are not losing sight of those historical imperatives. Hence today, as the ANC, we can stand up proudly and say that ours is about the development and the strengthening of an activist parliament, because an activist parliament is that parliament that will take into account all the very same aspects that members have been raising. These are strengthening the capacity of Parliament to do oversight and to be accountable, strengthening the capacity of Parliament or the legislatures to have that kind of relationship with the executive.
Our understanding of the separation of powers and the capacity of Parliament is not based on the liberal conceptualisation of oversight, because that conceptualisation sees Parliament as being a watchdog and an institution with the sole responsibility being to criticise, criticise, criticise. Ours is about a relationship, an understanding that there is a separation of powers, and each and every arm has a particular role to play and, by doing that, we complement one another. We do not just shout from the rooftops about how government or the executive is useless and is not doing their work without providing alternatives that seek to enhance the work of the executive. It is that particular role that we will be playing.
I think one of the things that is very important and unique, in actual fact - and I find it quite strange that it is raised by the DA again - is with the conceptualisation of the National Council of Provinces vis--vis how the Senate works. The basis of the establishment of the National Council of Provinces was, in actual fact, to ensure that we build on the capacity of local, provincial and national government in order to be able to work together, hence the intergovernmental relations. It is, therefore, important.
It would have been quite wise and very progressive, for instance, for the DA to have raised a question concerning the role of the SA Local Government Association, Salga. How, then, do we, as the National Council of Provinces, begin to look at the capacity and active role of Salga in the NCOP? I think it is a matter with regard to which we, as the ANC, say we are lacking in that particular area.
Therefore, we need to look at how best we can ensure that Salga plays the strategic role that it is supposed to play - by ensuring that they are actively involved, not only in plenaries in this particular House, but also even at the committee level. The question should probably be: Does Salga have that capacity? And what, therefore, becomes our role as the NCOP in terms of our budget and programme to capacitate and enable Salga to play an active role in the NCOP? I think that is a very important matter that we need to look at.
There is another thing that we, as the ANC, are raising, because we have made a very important observation on oversight and the role that committees are supposed to play vis--vis the leadership that must be provided to committees in order for them to do effective oversight. You would find that the Chairperson raises the question on strengthening the capacity of chairpersons of committees with content advisers, secretaries, and researchers. But the question we are raising is the disjuncture that you find that exists between the chair and the secretary of the committee in terms of their reporting mechanism. You would find that the chairperson has no role, no say over his or her own support mechanism. The secretary to the committee reports somewhere, the researcher reports somewhere else, and even, sometimes, the content advisers report somewhere else. [Applause.] That causes a serious disjuncture in terms of the functionality of committees.
Beyond that, maybe there is another question we need to ask ourselves, as Parliament, in terms of our budget. Are we really doing them justice in terms of support to committees, particularly committees of the National Council of Provinces, where you find clustered committees that must do oversight over three departments? Just one department can come and make a presentation to a committee of the NCOP, and it comes with two legal advisers, two researchers and the director-general. The department is heavily resourced, and now they sit here with these members whose capacity cannot match the capacity of the department. I think that is another matter that we really need to look at when we speak about this, especially when it comes to committees of the National Council of Provinces, namely whether really, we need to give the necessary and effective assistance.
Coupled to that, there is a particular wave that we see introduced. As much as the others, for instance Helen Zille, went out to say that this government or this executive has achieved zero under the leadership of President Zuma, there is a particular wave in the country, something new that is being introduced that seeks to revolutionise the functionality of the executive in terms of accountability to the President and accountability to the South African public through the signing of performance-based agreements.
The question that we need to ask ourselves as legislators now is how we position ourselves not to be left behind by the speed at which the executive is moving. If we do not do that, we may find ourselves lagging behind and chasing after the executive, where the executive is running at 340km per hour, while we are still at 60km per hour in terms of doing our oversight work, and so forth.
It is quite important that, as a legislative body, we need to reflect and ponder on some of these questions. What are the implications of these performance agreements between the President and the Ministers and the role of Parliament and its committees to do oversight?
Perhaps this is also important, Chair. In 2004-05, there was a concept that was introduced by the NCOP, and it gained momentum up to a point but we ran just short of implementing it - strengthening our oversight mechanism. One of the things that we were saying was about doing 70% oversight and being in the constituencies, and being in Parliament 30% of the time. That was informed, of course, by the fact that, since 1994 and up until that particular time, we had dealt a lot, and sufficiently so, with legislation.
Is it not possible to really revisit that particular concept and its relevance in strengthening our way of doing oversight? That means we would spend 70% of our time with the people that elected us, with the people that gave us a mandate. For the remaining 30% of the time, we would be here doing our legislative work and other things that are relevant to Parliament.
The last thing I thought would be quite important for us to look at closely is the question of the notion of taking Parliament to the people. Is it effective? Is it working for us? What are the gaps? What are the areas that we need to look at? For instance, an issue that we can begin to grapple with is the following: When we leave a place, how do we consistently keep that link with the people that we visited in order to ensure that by the time something happens in those areas, people are able to carry on and say, "If it were not because of the National Council of Provinces, this particular thing would not have happened"? This is an option, as opposed to merely going in and getting out without really ensuring that together we work with our people to find solutions to their problems.
I think it is quite important that as the NCOP we need to have a mechanism that will ensure that as and when we take Parliament to the people, whether it is the National Assembly through the People's Assembly, and so forth, we are still able to keep in touch and keep track of the issues that were raised by our people to ensure that they are not left behind.
Let me conclude by saying that a very important commitment was made. That commitment was based on the fact that, as Parliament, we passed legislation and we passed a Budget. That commitment also went to the construction workers, in that they were committed to constructing the stadiums, and so forth. As we speak today, the Local Organising Committee has lived up to that particular commitment, but only as far as the construction workers are concerned. We want to know what is going to happen to the Members of Parliament who passed the budget to ensure that those things do happen. On that note, thank you very much, Chairperson. [Applause.]
Chairperson, hon Tau, I am not a member of the Local Organising Committee. I am the Chairperson of the NCOP. I am not sure whether you will get the tickets or not but keep on trying your luck.
Let me start with you and reply to just one thing. I cannot reply to everyone. One of the two things that you have raised that is very important to me is the participation of Salga. That discussion has to continue in the Fourth Parliament and must take place. You are aware that I have said many times in this House that Salga has not taken its full place in the NCOP. I would like you, particularly as the House Chair, to assist me to take that discussion on. We cannot leave it like that because they have a role to play, and I believe, in terms of co-operative government and delivery of services on the ground by the local municipalities, Salga can play a very important role.
On the second thing you have raised, and I have heard it before, I want to say that I find it very strange that a report of a committee can be tabled in this House without a chairperson having gone through that report. I find it strange that the committee secretary just finalises the report, and then the report comes to the House. I don't know whether I heard you well. That report is the chairperson's and the committee's report. It cannot be the secretary's report.
It is like the Bill. When the Bill is before the committee, it is your Bill. You have to deal with it if there are amendments. I have said it many times. An example of this was the Children's Bill, as you will remember. It cannot be correct that you make some amendments to the Bill and when the Bill comes to the House to be passed, there are other amendments that you don't know about. Then you stand in the House and you say that you support the Bill but you don't know that somebody has added some amendments that you have not seen and discussed. The final piece of legislation that comes to the House should have been passed by the committee, and you should have agreed to those amendments.
The same applies to the report of the committee. The chairperson is the owner of that report. What is it then that you are debating about? Is it the report that you haven't seen and discussed? How do you defend it? I just want to support you with that one. I think secretaries to the committees must be very careful. Let them give support to the chairpersons, but don't let them take over from the chairpersons. That is their job. They should not take over. They must give support to the chairpersons. Everything has to be checked by the chairperson before it comes to the House. The last important thing which you have mentioned is the question of follow- ups on our public participation. It doesn't matter whether it is Taking Parliament to the People, public participation on policy issues or any matter that the committee has undertaken. What is of importance is those regular follow-ups in order for us to get in touch, either with those communities or the leadership around there, to ensure that things are happening the way we want them to happen. That is the capacity -and- I agree with you - that we need to build. Committees should actually build them into their programmes when they carry out their oversight function.
You've already said to me that we went to Limpopo and that we should go back. I am going back with a small team in May. I will take one or two of you people. We are going to do some work with the leadership there to check what they have done up to now because it is leading up to the new local government budget which will be in July. Before they finalise their budget we would like to know what they have done about the issues that have been raised by the people there. We would like to know what the province has done because provinces have their entire budget to apply already to those particular municipalities in order to address some of the issues there. We will do that. [Interjections.] I said I will take a few people with. You must leave it to the chairperson. I will take a few people. I will definitely not go alone.
I have listened to Prince Zulu, Mr Gunda and Mr Plaatjie. All members, including Mr Tau, have emphasised the oversight function. I realise how important this aspect of work is to us as members. I am very happy about that. Without us doing that type of work, it will be as if we are glued to our chairs. It will be as if we do not see what is happening out there. That is the most important work that Members of Parliament have to do, because we represent the people on the ground. We are their mouths, their voices and everything. We have the power, and we are their saviour. If we don't do that, we will not achieve anything. I am very glad that members have a full grasp of that. Maybe it is of importance that more capacity is built around the Members of Parliament in order to do all those things. I must thank you.
Prince Zulu, for the past three years Parliament has never had qualifications from the Auditor-General. [Applause.] We are managing our money very well. Nobody can say that there is anything wrong with our budget. It has taken us five to six years to remove that. When we took over as presiding officers, we found qualifications that were nearing disclaimers, unfortunately. We, together with the Secretary to Parliament, have overturned that to make our budget more effectively managed. With the Bill that we have passed now, the Financial Management of Parliament Bill, we will do much better to manage our finances in Parliament.
Mr Watson, on your comment on the involvement of the members of the NCOP, I can guarantee that we are involved. We are so small in the NCOP in terms of size. I don't know what we will do if we are not involving each other. Democracy is about involving other people. I want to repeat it. It is important that everybody is involved, whether you agree on a thing or not. I have said to you many times in this House that involvement does not mean that we will agree all the time on the issues on the table. It does not mean that. We will disagree and sometimes agree. We will find each other where we can find each other. That is an important thing.
Dialogue is very important because one will hear all the sides of the people in this institution. We will keep doing that, and I believe in it. Openness and transparency are very good principles of democracy. We will discuss with the people who are in the institution and take decisions together. You will have a very peaceful institution. You will have an institution that achieves things, rather than having a setback with the things that we are doing in this House.
I am very happy about the way we are functioning, and some of us might be staying a little behind and we are saying: Die agteros kom ook in die kraal [Even those who progress slowly eventually reach their destinations].
We will not leave you behind. We will take you with us. That is important. Let's assist each other.
In terms of the questions, you are correct. I have made it my job to check, every quarter at least, how many questions have not been answered by the executive so that I can respond on behalf of the members of this House. I have done that again this quarter because we are just finishing our first quarter.
I have already written a letter to the Deputy President. It is here in front of me. If you want a copy of it, you can just ask me. There is a total of 38 written questions from members to which there has been no response. I am not taking this very kindly, because I think 38 questions not responded to are many questions. I have already written to the Deputy President, and I have asked him to intervene as a matter of urgency. It is mostly on the written questions. On oral questions, Ministers come here and they respond to the questions, but the problem comes in with written questions. I have done a check again. From 19 March until 16 April, these questions have not been responded to. I have taken the matter up already with the Deputy President.
In terms of the Rules, I should commend you. Mr Jacobs, the chairperson of the subcommittee on review of Council Rules, and you, as members, have done a wonderful job. I have never seen people working at the speed that you have done. I thought that it would take us another year to review those Rules. You would remember that in the Third Parliament you and I discussed that we should revisit our Rules. The Programming Committee agreed that we should revisit all our Rules because they were drafted in 1994 when we came here. We have completed the review of our Rules. Is the workshop for the Programming Committee or for all of us? The workshop is for the Rules committee on 4 June.
In terms of the point of order, I heard that you have raised it and the presiding officers will meet soon. We will look at ourselves in terms of how we are dealing with those issues concerning the Rules. I want to introduce something in this House. When you stand up on a point of order, can you carry your book with you? Can you tell the Chairperson that you are standing up on a point of order in terms of Rule 106? I want to teach you that.
People just stand up on a point of order, even if it is not a point of order. That wastes the time of the House and interrupts the business of the House. That, at the same time, will teach you how to use the Rules. You are assisting me, as the Chair. You will know if the member is correct or wrong, in terms of Rule 106. You will know if the member could not have raised a point of order, in terms of Rule 106. If we carry our books, even though we memorise the Rule, we can just refer to the Rule. I will then check the Rules while I am sitting here. It also teaches me because I forget some of the Rules. All of us will learn the Rules by doing this. Mr Watson, the other point that you have raised was actually raised by Mr Bloem. I have advised that you should write to the Constitutional Review Committee to look at whether we can deal with that and other discussions can take place. Thank you. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.