Central Firearm Registry Progress report & Norwood Police Station firearms; with Deputy Minister

Meeting report

Chairperson's opening remarks 

The Chairperson said the Committee had had engagements on the Central Firearms Registry (CFR), and would also be briefed about the Norwood Police Station firearms. She reminded the Committee that they would be visiting the Norwood and Tembisa police stations on 4 and 5 March. She commended the police for the good work that they had done in Rosettenville. 

She had received an apology from the Minister, who had an important matter that he had to present to Cabinet. She would be quite strict this quarter about allowing the Minister to attend Cabinet meetings. However, if the Committee wanted the Minister to attend its meetings every Wednesday, then nothing would go to Cabinet. If it wanted the SAPS Amendment Bill to go to Cabinet and Cabinet committees, it would have to allow the Minister to attend Cabinet meetings. 

There were serious matters and challenges that needed to be taken to the Joint Standing Committee on Intelligence. The Committee had seen the outcome of the High-Level Review Panel report on the violence in KwaZulu-Natal (KZN) and Gauteng, so the Minister and National Commissioner would be called to the Joint Standing Committee on Intelligence regularly. Apologies were also accepted from the National Commissioner, who was attending a meeting with the Joint Standing Committee on Intelligence. 

She had invited the State Information Technology Agency (SITA) to this meeting, as she was sure that the Committee would want to engage with it. She could not get the Department of Public Works and Infrastructure (DPWI) to attend at such short notice, but she had committed to having its Minister, the Deputy Minister and Director-General meet with this Committee. 

The Committee would await the South African Human Rights Commission (SAHRC) report on its investigation, as the investigation was ongoing. As soon as the SAHRC report was completed, it would be referred to the Speaker, and the Speaker would then refer it to the Committee. The Committee would follow this with keen interest. 

The consultative period for the Criminal Law (Forensic Procedures) Amendment Bill would be extended by two weeks. There had been an error, so the erratum would be published, with the email address for to which public inputs could be sent. 

Adoption of Minutes

The Committee's minutes of 16 February was considered and adopted. 

Deputy Minister’s comments 

Mr Cassel Mathale, Deputy Minister of Police, confirmed that no police officers had died during the Rosettenville incident. There had been a media report that one of the police officers had died, but it was not correct. There were fatalities amongst the criminals. The police did brilliant work yesterday. He thanked the Committee for the words of encouragement. It was always a privilege for the South African Police Service (SAPS) to appear before the Committee and give an account of what they were doing. 

SAPS Presentation: Progress report on Central Firearms Register (CFR)

Lt Gen Sehlahle Masemola, Deputy National Commissioner: Policing, presented the progress from 1 April 2021 to 31 December 2021, as well as the status of the systems and alternative accommodation for the CFR. 

(See document for detail)

A total of 321 405 firearm licence applications had been received for the first three quarters of 2021/2022. A total of 326 942 firearm licence applications were still outstanding, and this included 79 868 amnesty applications. A total of 247 186 firearm applications at the CFR were finalised.

Altogether 165 952 firearms were surrendered for the two firearm amnesty periods. A total of 723 959 rounds of ammunition were surrendered for the two firearm amnesty periods. 

The migration from the Veritas building to Telkom Towers had been put on hold. The migration process would commence once the Department of Public Works and Infrastructure had addressed the identified challenges.

Input from SITA 

Mr Luvuyo Keyise, Chief Executive Officer (CEO), SITA, said that SITA was finalising the procurement process for the e-filing system on behalf of SAPS. The tender for the e-filing strategy was R1.5 million. The tender process had closed at the end of January. He confirmed that the matter had been concluded, and SITA would communicate with SAPS to confirm how it would assist it in the process of developing an e-filing strategy so that it could start implementing the e-filing solution. 

As presented, the procurement processes for the firearm control system had been concluded in October, but due to the structure of SITA, the tender management was concluded at board level. It was the board that made the final decision based on the information submitted. The board term had ended at the end of November 2021 and was not continued. There was unfortunately a four-month period for ensuring that the Minister of the Department of Communications and Digital Technologies (DCDT) appointed a new board. The new board had been appointed at the beginning of this month and had its induction yesterday. The board would ensure that it concludes the matter that SITA’s management had submitted to board level since October last year, by no later than Friday next week. 

Mr Keyise said he had the induction with the board yesterday to explain the service delivery implications of not concluding this matter -- the financial implication for SAPS, as well as the court order to the Minister of Police if this decision was prolonged. The board chairperson had confirmed that the matter would be concluded by no later than next Friday; failing which the management would be given the necessary delegation authority to ensure that this matter was concluded in a way that did not affect the service delivery of the SAPS. 

The Minister had also made pronouncements that included that procurement matters of departmental specific solutions, like what had been discussed today, should be done by departments. This meant that SAPS should also be able to run and conclude their information communication technology (ICT) procurement on service delivery-related department-specific solutions. It was understood that this was a process that the Minister intended to ensure it started working from 1 April. The Department and ministry would then be procuring all the necessary communication within February to prepare departments so that they could take over part of this procurement process. 

SITA management had committed to supporting departments in this transition period to ensure that they could take over procurement on client-specific matters and be provided with transition support so that there were no service delivery implications for them purely because of delayed tender processes. 

Input from DCDT

Ms Nonkqubela Jordan-Dyani, Acting Director-General, DCDT, acknowledged that there had been delays from the Department's side concerning the appointment of the SITA board. The board had been asked to prioritise the outstanding tenders urgently. It was committed to resolving this matter by next week Friday. The DCDT was working on the repurposing of SITA, so in the next financial year there would be announcements as to how it would still ensure the modernisation of SITA’s services for government, but at the same time deal with the issues related to transversal systems. The DCDT would consult Cabinet with its proposals and the announcements would be issued thereafter. 

Discussion 

Mr A Whitfield (DA) said that the delays in processing the firearm applications were completely unacceptable, regardless of the reasons. SAPS knew full well that undertaking an amnesty would lead to an increase in administration for the licensing process. He asked that it be confirmed, that for the last two years since the Forensic Data Analysts (FDA) firearm permit system (FPS) had been switched off, the main reason for the delay was that SAPS was still working with a pen and paper system to administer the firearm licensing application process. What was the implication of any litigation pending in connection with the FDA’s firearm permit system? He recalled that there had been a dispute in this regard, and asked that the Committee get an update. 

In October 2019, SAPS had presented to this Committee and admitted that there were SAPS members who had criminal records and who had been involved with firearms processing and ballistics. It was two and a half years later, and he would like to know if there were still SAPS members who had criminal records and were dealing with firearms processing and ballistics. If there were, why was this the case? If not, then what had been done to those who had criminal records and who had been part of the CFR process? 

The Committee knew that the lost and stolen firearms from SAPS custody was an ongoing issue, and perhaps it was related to the issue at the Norwood police station. He asked what percentage of privately owned firearms had been reported lost or stolen from SAPS 13 stores. The SAPS 13 evidence lockers were targets of criminals, and former SAPS Colonel Chris Prinsloo had been instrumental in channeling both SAPS firearms and privately owned firearms that were destined for destruction, through the CFR and into criminal hands. 

Mr O Terblanche (DA) congratulated the police on the excellent work that they had done in Rosettenville. He had hoped that they would be able to duplicate that type of service delivery in other divisions, especially in the firearms section. Part of the delays in SAPS was to a large extent because of other service providers like the DPWI and SITA, who were unable to render an effective and efficient service to SAPS. He had listened to the presentation about SAPS buildings and that they would not be ready in the foreseeable future, and would like to get timeframes on this. The Committee had received input from SITA, but he was concerned that the hot potato was again being passed back to SAPS, and he hoped that this did not delay SAPS any further. 

The Committee had received different presentations since 2019, and every time it got different figures, SAPS should indicate what the correct figures were regarding the firearms. The long outstanding applications and licensing of firearms were unacceptable. The amnesty-related applications had grown to almost 80 000. He understood that the Minister and National Commissioner were excused from this meeting, yet this Committee had given them instructions to formulate and implement a turnaround strategy, and it did not see anything about this and it was getting out of hand. The constituency offices were flooded with people complaining about the inability of the police to issue their firearm licences. He asked for an explanation for the significantly low number of finalised firearm applications.  

He knew that the Committee would also get a presentation on the Norwood police station firearms, but what worried him was that before it approved the amnesty, the Committee had got an assurance from SAPS that it would have proper safeguards places where the weapons would be kept. He asked whether SAPS still had properly safeguarded places to keep weapons in Gauteng and on a countrywide basis. 

Dr P Groenewald (FF+) said that about 29 877 firearm licenses had been outstanding for more than 241 days. He would like to have a further analysis after the 241 days because he knew of people who had complained and sent documents to his office that their firearm licences had been outstanding for more than two years, which was more than 700 days. He requested that there be further analysis on the 29 877 firearms licences that had been outstanding for more than 241 days. 

There was no doubt that there had been no progress. In fact, if one looked at the status of outstanding firearm applications at the CFR, it had gone from 176 970 in the first quarter and increased to 201 607 in the third quarter. He had heard about the omicron virus and other factors that negatively impacted the performance in the third quarter, but the fact was that there had been no progress. The backlog and the outstanding firearm applications had just increased. He thought that one of the reasons for this was poor planning. 

It had been said that the migration to Telkom Towers had been postponed due to the building not being ready, but when the Committee visited the CFR in May 2021, SAPS had already requested the Committee to support it so that the rental at the Veritas building would not be extended, and that it would end by September 2021. If they knew that they would not extend the rental contract and were looking for a new building, surely they should have made sure that the next building complied with all their requirements. The personnel at the Veritas building had been instructed to put piles of documents into crates because they planned to migrate to Telkom Towers, but then it was realised that the Telkom Towers building was not suitable and the personnel had to unpack those crates and start working again. At this moment, only one section had been relocated, and he asked which one it was. He questioned why there had been poor planning and why the Department did not realise that Telkom Towers did not meet its specifications. 

Mr A Seabi (ANC) appreciated the input from SITA, in that they had concluded the tender process for the e-filing strategy, and hoped that this would move things forward. He requested the DCDT to ensure that the SITA board finalise the procurement processes for the firearm control system by next Friday. In case of future instances, he asked what intervention could be made in the absence of the board. Was the board the only authority to conclude the procurement processes? He welcomed the repurposing of SITA, as some of the responsibility would revert to the departments, and this would avoid delays in the procurement processes. 

He asked whether SAPS was paying rent for both the Veritas building and Telkom Towers. He agreed that the Committee urgently needed to convene a meeting with the DPWI so that it could understand the challenges. 

On the firearm licence applications, he agreed with Mr Terblanche that the Committee had given the Minister and National Commissioner an instruction to formulate a turnaround strategy. He asked that this be made a matter of urgency so that the Committee could interrogate it and hold SAPS to account. The outstanding firearm licence applications were not pleasing. He asked if the overtime intervention was sustainable. 

The Chairperson said she had asked the DPWI to provide the Committee with a more detailed presentation, and that they should not respond only on the Veritas building and Telkom Towers. When the Committee addressed the anticipated under-spending, it had looked at the infrastructure spending pattern that was at 20.9%. SAPS had stated that four police stations would be completed in 2021/22. She said the Moeka-Vuma and Mabeskraal police stations were started in 2014 but had still not been completed and occupied in 2022, which was about eight years later. If it took eight years to build a police station, then this Department had a serious problem. The Committee would expect a full presentation from the DPWI on the police stations that were expected to be built, those that were supposed to be built but were never built, those that were currently being built and how far they were. This process of building police stations and the slow process of their delivery was very heavily impacting the crime prevention strategy. How would the Department prevent crime without police stations? 

The Committee was inundated with emails and calls about firearm licence applications. She received up to 100 emails a day of complaints about firearm licence applications which were outstanding for more than two years. The service delivery and performance of the Department were totally unacceptable. SAPS under-spending would be directly related to the DPWI and SITA. It had been requested that funds be rolled over, but money would be lost due to the DPWI and SITA. The SAPS budget would be cut over the Medium-Term Expenditure Framework (MTEF) period. SAPS could not continue asking for an increase in the budget if it was unable to spend its money. The Minister and the Deputy Minister were equally frustrated, so it was time that the Committee addressed this, as this matter involving the DPWI and SITA had been discussed since 2019. 

Rev K Meshoe (ACDP) said he did not know why SAPS, including the Minister of Police, had had to voice their frustrations for years because of the DPWI's failure to deliver. It did not make sense. If the DPWI could not serve SAPS with efficiency, then there must be a plan B, or else SAPS must be allowed to build its own buildings. It did not make sense that for years, from the Minister downwards, everybody complained about DPWI. If they could not deliver, then SAPS should do without them --there had to be a way out. 

The CFR had been supposed to relocate to Telkom Towers on 30 October last year -- had SAPS not consulted with the DPWI with regard to this date? If the DPWI had agreed that this would be the date when the CFR would relocate, then the DPWI had failed. When the Committee visited the Veritas building, it had not been told about the identified challenges, and it was not told about the additional repairs and renovations that had to be done at Telkom Towers. The impression given was that Telkom Towers was almost ready for occupation. 

He questioned if this was a delaying tactic. One of the concerns and questions raised last year was whether there was somebody in the top management of SAPS who was benefiting from renting the Veritas building, even though the building was in a very poor state. The staff at the Veritas building had said that the building demotivated them because there were signs that it might collapse. He asked who owned the Veritas building and who was benefiting from renting a building that was on the verge of collapse. 

The Committee had been told that the migration process would commence once the DPWI had addressed the identified challenges, but there were no timelines, which meant that this could take another two years. Since the DPWI had failed to build a single police station in eight years, how would it address these identified challenges in a short space of time if they had not been given a date by when it should be finished? He urged SAPS to insist that the DPWI give them a date by when the building would be completed. 

The Chairperson said she would ensure that the Committee’s programme for next term included a meeting with the DPWI. 

 

SAPS' response 

Lt-Gen Masemola said that there were currently no police officers at the CFR who had criminal convictions. Those that did have criminal convictions had been dealt with in terms of the disciplinary regulations and most of them were dismissed. There were still some ongoing criminal cases. 

SAPS would get the exact figure of privately owned firearms that had been stolen and inform the Committee. However, 41 amnesty firearms had been stolen and three firearms stolen in Mpumalanga. There were firearm storage facilities at police stations and provincial offices, and during the amnesty, most of the firearms were sent to the central stores in the provinces. The National Commissioner had approved for SAPS to look further at central storage, so it was engaging with various stakeholders, including the South African National Defence Force (SANDF) to reduce the number of firearms at police stations and move them to specific stores. 

SAPS acknowledged that there were long-outstanding firearm licence applications, and would engage with its legal services about what could be done. 

Regarding the move to Telkom Towers, SAPS had been told that it would be able to move out of the Veritas building by the end of September, so members had started packing. SAPS had been assured by its supply chain, together with the DPWI, that the repairs were not serious, and that they would be done. It was unfortunate that it was still not repaired -- even the lifts were still not working. The date to relocate was based on what SAPS had been told as to when the building would be completed. 

The section that had already moved to Telkom Towers was the section that dealt with permits and authorisations. 

He promised the Committee that SAPS would relook at its challenges with regard to the CFR buildings and the firearm control system that SITA had committed to conclude soon. It would look into the turnaround strategy Members had alluded to, to see what it could do to satisfy members of the public. 

Maj Gen Maropeng Mamotheti, Component Head: Firearms, Liquor and Second-hand Goods Control, said that SAPS had been consistent in its reporting of figures to the Committee after being informed that they were not tallying. Regarding the number of firearms that had been surrendered, SAPS used the figures in the system and had also checked manually on what was still outstanding in terms of capturing, and these figures had been added up. During December, the Western Cape had indicated that they had done an audit to verify whether there were still some firearms that were sitting at the stations, and had found 125 firearms that were still not captured on the system, which was why the figure had increased to 165 952 during December. Other than that, the figures submitted to the Committee were consistent. 

SAPS acknowledged that the overtime work was not sustainable, but it would still continue with overtime under the current circumstances to take advantage of the fact that most of the members were back in the office, while continuously motivating them so that they could deliver as promised. 

Maj Gen S Hankins, Divisional Commissioner: Supply Chain Management, said the commitment that SAPS had made to the Committee that the CFR would be vacating the Veritas building at the end of its lease period at the end of October, had been based absolutely on the commitment from the DPWI. It had said that the IT building would be ready for occupation and that the CFR would be able to move in on 1 November. When the time came to move, the DPWI had then told SAPS that the IT building was unfortunately not ready for occupation and that they were looking at a period of two more years for the completion of the IT building. 

SAPS had tried to think of what else could be arranged to move out of the Veritas building. At that stage, part of the northern tower building and annex building of Telkom Towers had been handed over to SAPS. SAPS had identified a possible space that could be utilised by the CFR at the annex building. She emphasised that the annex building was handed over to SAPS by the DPWI, but when SAPS went to the building, they had picked up all the challenges that had been raised, such as the visible water leaks in the basement area, the lifts not working, and carpets in a terrible condition. SAPS had got the DPWI back on site, highlighted their concerns to them and informed them that in order for the CFR to move into the building, those matters needed to be fixed as a matter of urgency. SAPS had been communicating with the DPWI on a regular basis. There had been a meeting yesterday with the DPWI and SAPS, chaired by the Deputy Minister. SAPS had tried to tie them down to timelines to complete the work that needed to be done in the annex building but unfortunately did not get any commitments. There was an indication that the DPWI was still in the process of appointing a contractor for the work to be completed at the building. 

While the CFR was still at the Veritas building, it was paying rent on a month-to-month basis. The landlord had made attempts at some upgrading to the building. It was not complete, but there had been work done with regard to the lift, as well as the air conditioning, so at least the landlord had come in to do some repairs. As an additional and immediate solution, SAPS would be in the process of at least relocating some of the old documentation to the annex building storeroom. There would just need to be some security added to the storeroom, and also to ensure that the dampness did not have an impact on the documents. 

SAPS had committed to complete the Moeka-Vuma and Mabeskraal police stations this year, and they had been completed. It was also committed to complete the Riemvasmaak police station, but unfortunately the contractor had been delaying the completion of the work. However, the finalisation of this police station was almost done. SAPS appreciated that the Committee endeavoured to meet with the DWPI to get answers and perhaps tie it down to timeframes because SAPS had really battled to get timeframes from them. 

She confirmed that SAPS was paying rent only for the Veritas building and not for Telkom Towers, as it was a state-owned building. 

Maj Gen Edith Mavundla, Head: Technology Management Services, said that the firearm permit system (FPS) had been switched off in 2018. From 15 October 2020, SITA had been tasked by SAPS to look at an alternative solution. SITA may therefore be required to indicate the status of this alternative against the solution that had been developed before because there were claims that had followed on the development of the FPS. 

The Deputy Minister suggested that SITA respond to the alternative system. 

Mr Keyise said that SITA had been tasked by SAPS to develop an alternative to the FPS. This had been done but had also been stopped. SAPS had re-tasked SITA to further develop the FPS system. If required, SITA would provide a detailed progress report on how far it was with the development that it had recently been tasked to do -- this may be available within a week. The challenges with service delivery had started in 2019, during the two-year period when SITA had really tried to work with SAPS to ensure that it addressed service delivery and Board-related issues. He agreed that if the instance that there was no SITA board recurred, then the legislative or legal instruments should ensure that at least a person in management was given the necessary delegation to ensure that service delivery was not hampered. However, SITA could confirm that the decision that the DCDT Minister had made would ensure that the bulk of the procurement that was related to service delivery, would move over to the departments from 1 April. SITA would have sessions with SAPS in March to ensure that they worked together on how to migrate the services over to SAPS. 

Ms Jordan-Dyani (DCDT) said she had taken note of the question on how SITA or its department could mitigate the challenges going into the future. This would correctly be addressed in terms of the legislation. Moving forward, the departments would have control over certain aspects of the procurement of IT or ICT systems. 

The Chairperson said that the Committee welcomed the inputs by SITA and the DCDT, even though they were not very pleased with them. The Committee would be contacting the DCDT Minister and Deputy Minister and would be keeping its finger on the pulse. The Committee was disappointed but would intensify its efforts. The entire country was at risk because of unlicensed and illegal firearms.  

Rev Meshoe said that the question on the ownership of the Veritas building had not been answered. 

Maj Gen Hankins said that the rental agreement for the Veritas building was a contract between the DPWI and the landlord. 

Chairperson’s comments 

The Chairperson said that it was time for the Committee to intervene promptly. It would not receive answers until SITA and the DPWI addressed the Committee. She could not have the same questions for two to three years -- this was completely unacceptable. The Committee's oversight visit to Norwood and Tembisa police stations during the first week of March had been approved by the House Chair. 

Deputy Minister’s comments 

Deputy Minister Mathale said that the challenge of SAPS needing to rely on other departments for its tools of trade was a problem. Yesterday, it had decided that it would urgently need to meet with the DPWI to discuss some of these challenges with them. There had also been problems with the ministry moving into their new offices in Telkom Towers. SAPS had gone through the offices for the CFR and realised that if they did not urgently meet with the DPWI Minister, there were going to be problems. He welcomed the Committee's plans to meet with the DPWI, the DCDT and SITA so that SAPS could address its challenges. 

SAPS have also identified weaknesses within its supply chain. The lack of construction and project management professionals within SAPS had also contributed to the problem of delayed construction of police stations. SAPS had had interactions with its supply chain management to deal with this aspect, by searching for professionally trained construction managers and project managers to come into this space. 

He was concerned about the issue involving SITA being tasked to develop an alternative to the FPS, which had been stopped and then re-tasked for further development. This meant that what had been said would happen, had not happened. He had not been made aware of this dynamic and had heard about it when only the CEO of SITA had responded. This would have not been known if Mr Whitfield had not asked the question. This was a matter that needed to be further discussed with SITA to understand why the dynamic had changed. 

Norwood Police Station firearms

Brigadier David Bender, Office of the SAPS Provincial Commissioner: Gauteng, ran through the purpose of the presentation on matters pertaining to the Norwood Police Station, including

 the aspects relating to the theft of firearms at the station.

Background to firearm situation

In July 2021, the Ballistics Section, Forensic Science Laboratory (FSL) had informed the National Priority Violent Crimes Bureau (NPVCB): Directorate for Priority Crimes Investigation (DPCI), that four firearms that were previously submitted for analysis, had been recovered from two crime scenes. The possibility existed that these firearms had been stolen from the Norwood SAPS 13 store, and as such an inquiry was registered. 

The audit of the SAPS 13 store and firearms had continued from August, during which time various

 discrepancies and anomalies in contravention of prescripts had been uncovered. It was established, with a reasonable degree of certainty, that 175 firearms were missing from the safe. These included 134 exhibit firearms and 41 amnesty firearms. This figure may increase, as the investigation progresses. The Station Commander of the Norwood Police Station had resigned on 14 January. An acting Station Commander, Lt Col Athlenda Mathe had since been appointed.

Measures implemented to address areas of concern

Several actions had been implemented at Norwood police station, including:

• Conducting intermittent inspections, a full-scale inspection and investigation of identified managers and supervisors. 

• The establishment of a district detective intervention team during November 2021, focusing on case dockets versus SAPS 13 exhibits.

• Conducting a case docket analysis by Crime Intelligence on specific cases relating to drug charges.

• Development and implementation of an action plan by the District Commissioner. 

• Appointment of a new management team.

(See attached document for details)

Lt Gen Elias Mawela, Provincial Commissioner: Gauteng, emphasised that firearm proliferation remained a problem in the Gauteng province -- even the major incident involving former SAPS Col Chris Prinsloo had happened in this province. The Gauteng SAPS management was definitely serious about dealing with this matter, and anyone who stood in the way of good governance would be dealt with decisively. 

 

Discussion

Mr Whitfield said that for this to happen at one police station once-off would be one thing, but for it to happen twice over a period of a year at a single police station was absolutely shocking. It was clear that SAPS members were complicit in the distribution of firearms from SAPS 13 evidence stores into criminal hands. The reference to Col Prinsloo was also evidence that members of the SAPS had been complicit in the distribution of not only the Z88 SAPS firearms but also the surrendered firearms that ended up at the SAPS 13 evidence stores. Members of the public who had complied with the amnesty notice and law-abiding firearm owners obviously expected their firearms to be safe in every police station or every locker at a provincial or national level. 

Last year, when the Norwood police station was in the news for the wrong reasons, the Committee had raised the issue of an audit, and he was very pleased that the audit had been done. The Committee needed a response from SAPS at the national level as to whether they had embarked on an audit on the same terms as the one at Norwood had been conducted at every single police station and every single evidence locker where firearms were kept. There needed to be a national firearms audit at every single police station, despite the enormity of the task. Until there was an audited list of firearms, the Committee would never be able to fully comprehend the national security risk that these police stations ironically presented to the country. 

Police stations were often attacked, and their own security measures were not up to scratch. Criminals were not scared to pursue these attacks on police stations because more often than not, they did not fear the consequences. In many of these attacks and thefts, there were very serious numbers of firearms and ammunition stolen. The Committee needed to be clear and united in a call for a national firearms audit at all SAPS 13 stores and any other lockers where firearms were kept. The basis upon which the audit was done at Norwood had been excellent, but SAPS needed to be preemptive and not reactive to avoid the next theft of firearms at police stations. 

Mr Terblanche noted that the person in charge of the Norwood SAPS 13 store was only a sergeant. He was not implying that a sergeant was not competent enough, but he questioned when last and how often this SAPS 13 store was visited and inspected by any person such as a station commander, provincial commissioner or inspectorate before the incident occurred. He welcomed the audit that had been done, but it was apparently not yet finalised, as the investigation was still ongoing. He requested clarity on this. 

Apparently, the proper management of firearms was not regarded and taken seriously by SAPS. There was very minimal consequence management within SAPS for this type of loss. He asked that SAPS inform the Committee about what they would do differently about consequence management and the investigation of these incidents. 

Ms N Peacock (ANC) agreed that there would need to be a firearms audit across all police stations. SAPS should provide the date when the amnesty firearms had been surrendered and indicate why the firearms were still held at the police station. During the previous presentation from SAPS, it was stated that central storage facilities had been established in all provinces. There needed to be a national initiative to ensure that what had happened at Norwood police station did not happen in other provinces. There was a process plan that had been sent in relation to the amnesties, but it seemed as if not all police stations had complied with this. This should be regarded as an urgent matter. 

The Chairperson reminded the Deputy Minister to inform his team that where questions were not responded to, the responses needed to be sent to the Committee two weeks after the meeting. The presentations needed to be provided to the Committee a week before a meeting. 

 

SAPS' response 

Lt-Gen Masemola responded to the need for a national firearms audit and said there was a national team but it was quite limited. SAPS would look at getting members from various police stations to increase the capacity to undertake such a task. There were central storage facilities in most of the provinces, and there was a process flow of how SAPS should do things. 

Lt Gen Mawela clarified that the theft at Norwood happened only once -- it was not two incidents. However, there had been such incidents of theft at other police stations. Gauteng had already started firearm audits in its SAPS 13 evidence stores, as it was suspected that it could also have happened at other police stations. The outcome would be reported to the National Commissioner, who would then report back to the Committee. Gauteng did have a list of identified storage facilities that met the minimum-security standards where firearms would be secured. 

Regarding when last an inspection was done at the Norwood police station, he said the incident had resulted in the registering of departmental disciplinary cases against identified managers and supervisors precisely to address this concern. There was an obligation, in terms of the national instructions, for weekly and monthly inspections which were conducted regularly at the station level. The head of visible policing had the responsibility to conduct weekly inspections and the station commander had the responsibility to conduct monthly SAPS 13 store inspections. This had not been done by the previous management, resulting in disciplinary cases against them. The last provincial inspection conducted at the Norwood police station had been in 2014. As part of one of the interventions, there would be a full-scale inspection by the provincial inspectorate, which had already started on 1 February. 

For the Norwood police station, 444 firearms had been received during the 2019/20 amnesty period, and 200 during the 2020/21 amnesty period. All the firearms were taken through the necessary processing, but the process was stopped once the incident was reported, and the SAPS 13 store was completely sealed so that no further activity could take place in that space to allow the DPCI to continue with their audit. 

Mr Terblanche said he had not yet heard a response on the issue of consequence management. 

Lt Gen Mawela said that per the SAPS disciplinary regulations, two disciplinary cases were registered against the management at the Norwood police station for their failure to comply with the prescripts. There was also a disciplinary case that was underway, where a Firearms, Liquor and Second-Hand Goods (FLASH) member at the station had also failed to comply with the prescripts. Criminal cases had been opened, even though the main suspect had died by suicide, but those that were still around, including the former station commander, were not off the hook. The inquiry that was opened by the DPCI had translated into a criminal case, which meant that they were collecting concrete evidence against those who had participated directly or indirectly in the loss of the firearms at the Norwood police station. 

The Deputy Minister said he had taken note of the concerns raised, including the timelines for the submissions and written responses to outstanding questions. SAPS would do its best to comply and would engage with the Committee to address the challenges. 

 

Chairperson's closing remarks 

The Chairperson thanked the Deputy Minister and his team for the presentations. The Committee did not have the luxury of time, and could only commit to working together as a team. It would have its oversight visit to Norwood police station during the first week of March, and Lt Gen Mawela would assist in the oversight visit. 

The Committee understood that the item on the Cabinet agenda required the Committee to have its input there, or else decisions would be taken on its behalf. The Committee was also aware that the Joint Standing Committee on Intelligence could only receive either the Minister or National Commissioner, and they could not send a representative, so it understood the reason for those apologies. 

The meeting today had been businesslike but had included many concerns and complaints. In his State of the Nation Address (SONA), the President had set the tone for the agenda of the Justice, Crime Prevention and Security Cluster, and the role of the Department of Police was central to the functioning of that cluster. 

The meeting was adjourned.